Bowes and Bounds Connected

A Community Network for Bowes Park and Bounds Green

REINSTATE RIGHT TURN ON THE TOP OF BOUNDS GREEN WHITTINGTON ROAD "JUNCTION

    DEAR ALL

     Recently spoke to enfield traffic management  to see if it would be feasable to make the whittington road / palmerston road junction no entry on exit and also the bowes road north circular road palmerston road no entry no exit    and reinstate the right turn at bounds green road and whittington road, so that residents of bowes park can easily access the gordon road clinic n11 , unfortunately dr prasad passed away , and we have to register with the n11 clinic , it also makes it easier to commute to new southgate and muswell hill easier if the right turn is reopened.

i was told i would stand a better chance if i obtained the support of the residents , as this suggestion would undoubtedly help enfield with their traffic calming measures.

Numerous emails to the Haringey counterpart resulted in receiving polite patronising emails advising me that it would be considered whenever , but not immediately ,

i wonder if i can reach out to the residents especially of whittington road to support me in my efforts as it will also undoubtedly stop the speeding traffic from and to palmerston road via whittington road

.

looking forward to hearing your views on this matter.

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I live on the bend of Whittington not far from the Bounds Green Road junction.  When it was possible to turn right out of Whittington there were daily traffic jams, lots of horn hooting and arguments that often ended in threatening fights between drivers etc.  The closure of this turn was the best thing that has happened to traffic in the area, and it would be truly shocking if it was changed. It took a lot of work to get this improvement, and I would campaign strongly against your suggestion.  

And as to Enfield traffic management - thank goodness i live in Haringey.  Many of the new arrangements they have put in place in Palmers Green are crazy and downright dangerous.  So please think again Bernadette

Thank you for your response ..

i moved here in August 69 , when there were so many under 30s living in the area, and  haringey officials were allowed to use  common sense to deal with such issues,.I understand that Haringey council  notably planning and traffic management accept your views as represtative of all the residents of Bowes Park, and you are a highly respected resident of Bowes Park

There was work going on on the north circular / bowes road which resulted in whottington road being used as a rat run  and the officer confirmed to me that the reason for withdrawing the right turn was to stop the road being used as a rat run whilst bowes road was being converted to three lanes.,??/

 if the junction of whittington road was made no entry  no exit , it stands to reason that only the local residents would use the right turn and only the local residents would use the left turn to access whittington road .

can you  please advise me of the best route to take , given that i am disabled and will need to attend gordon road surgery by car , after we take the left out of whittington road what in your opinion is the quickest route to get to gordon road surgery , or to get to say the builders depot . topps tiles etc.

By the way Caroline do you drive , ?? 

Ps i i have lived in Bowes PArk for 50 years and 4 months, and yes i also love Haringey Council. but where have all the upwardly mobile youngsters  with fresh ideas gone   , N!0 and N8* with no restrictions on right turns , .she says lightheartedly.

Happy New Year to all 

Gosh, you have lived here a long time, Bernadette, and must have seen a great deal of changes.

No... I do not drive, but have pals who do.

Where do you live?  Then we could perhaps advise your quickest route.

And a Happy New Year to you too.

 Dear Caroline.

i was advised to start a petition but i will not be seeking the views of non drivers as the right turn will not effect non drivers , and hopefully the outcome if positive  will attract younger people to move   the some of the large under occupied properties in the vicinity.

i am very ill  , i am not doing this  for myself , i am doing it for posterity., there is no point in using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.they seem to be moving to the smaller converted homes in n8 and n10, a city needs young blood with young ideas.,, i guess a part of the process of growing old is to think one is right,lord knows i suffer with this malaise.

kind regards

Once thing that we learned during the years that it took to achieve traffic calming in the area was that  it requires a system approach not bits and pieces. The no right turn at the top of Whittington works because it was part of an area strategy. Before the changes roads were congested with traffic jams-traffic nor moving at all-static vehicles pumping out high levels of pollution. Jams started as early as 5/6am. Road rage was an everyday event. Massive lorries were directed through the area and got stuck on the tight corners. Police were called out to intervene in fights. Yes fights! Road rage everyday.

So, please review your position on this. One thing we need to do is to try to stop people sitting in their vehicles with their engines running. That helps to decrease pollution. Also, the pedestrianisation of Myddleton Road-with delivery schedules built in-which has been suggested would be really good.

HI Bernadette

Like Caroline I was involved with the road changes when they were implemented some years ago.  It was a long and tortuous process because if you look at the map of the area it becomes clear that there are many ways into Bounds Green but very few roads take you out to Bounds Green Road.  The changes, as Caroline said, were partly to help the residents of Whittingdon access the road from their drives, cut down on the constant arguments that occurred with increasing frequency and ferocity and also to make Whittingdon, Truro, Clarence and Nightingale have a balanced flow of traffic.  It would have been easy to make changes which moved the traffic flow of cars from one street into their neighbours roads, but took quite a lot of thought and help from the council to come up the the current plan which works for most local people whether pedestrians or car owners.  I

If you want to get to Gordon Road from Whittington then your best bet is to go by Truro or Clarence.  Doesn't take long.

Dear Cathy  and  Kate

i i am disappointed to note  

yjar yjere  is no feedback   to  my suggestion to consider making the  the junction from whittington to palmerston and palmerston to bowes road no entry no exit, except to condemn enfield councils traffic management policy as downright dangerous.

i have lived in the area for 50 plus years so i know every nook and cranny in the area.

when i made for  a tongue in cheek request for directions like my suggestion the irony was lost due to the intense

fear for want of a better word of the possibilty of the powers that be perhaps agreeing with my suggestion , 

i really cannot see any changes being made in the Boes Park area   unless it is initiated by Caroline , so you have no reason to be unduly concerned.many of Carolines suggestions have been actioned by the council and enhanced the area.. 

. Can you also in addition to my suggestion in para 1   please let me know how often in any given week are you  both required to make a left turn at the the top of whittington road ,as i am naturally assuming that you both drive and therefore have personal experience of the road rage referred to by Caroline.

Please do confirm if you drive.

thanks very much  bernadette

.

PLEASE NOTE < THE RIGHT TURN AT WHITTINGTON CANNOT BE REINSTATED IN ISOLATION < IT HAS TO CARRIED OUT IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE INTRODUCTION OF THE NO ENTRY NO EXIT SIGNS AT THE JUNCTION OF  WHITTINGTON AND PALMERSTON ROAD AND PALMERSTON AND BOWES ROAD>IN THE ENFIELD BOUNDARY < THE OFFICER I DISCUSSED IT WITH HAPPENED TO HAVE BEEN BORN IN PALMERSTON ROAD AND FELT THERE WAS SOME MERIT IN MY SUGGESTION /p>

IT IS MISLEADING THE RESIDENTS AND UNFAIR TO DEAL WITH HALF A PROPOSAL AND IGNORE THE OTHER HALF OF THE PROPOSAL   

 NEED:ESS TO SAY IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE RESIDENTS WHO DO NOT DRIVE  FREQUENTLY OR CANNOT DRIVE  EVEN THOUGH IT WAS THEIR BRAINCHILD TO WITHDRAW THE RIGHT TURN >REFRAIN FROM INFLUENCING THE OUTCOME AS THEY ARE NOT EFFECTEF BY THE NO RIGHT TURN< IT DOES NOT EFFECT PEDESTRIANS 

Dear Bernadette,

While I do not want this to turn into some sort of on-line argument, I do feel that it is important to say that it was NOT my brainchild, or of other individuals on Whittington, that cars no longer turn right out of Whittington - it was part of a very large and well thought-out and well consulted scheme from TfL and Haringey and Enfield councils for a much larger area.  Traffic calming/management does not only effect drivers, but pedestrians, cyclists and local residents, and the consultations were lengthy and considered. 

The fact that I do not have a car, and do not drive, does not invalidate my opinion on the beneficial effects of the present scheme, I walk a lot locally and live on this road and I would indeed give my opinion in any future traffic management consultation.

Is it fair Caroline to open discussion on one aspect of my suggestion and totally ignore the other aspect of my suggestion.

Is it  fair to say that enfields traffic calming measures are downright dangerous simply because i stated that they felt their was some merit in  introducing the no entry no exit in the whittington palmerston junction and palmerston whbowes road junction.

Can you not see that Enfield agreed to do this , the only cars entering whittington would owned by local residents,

Ten years ago this was the right move as the the three lanre improvement resulted in our road being used as as a rat run road.

But ten years down the line can we not see that the present system penalises local drivers and residents , why should we have to go left to go to Barnet . muswell hill and the tuve station when it is to the right.

if the no entry no exit is installed , you will not have a single car speeding down the road to get to the north corcular and green lanes and a single car accessing whittington road to get to bounds green road.

i cannot understand why  despite the numerous emails we have exchanged you are ignoring my suggestion to make the enfield end of whittington and palmerston and palmerston and the north circular no entry.

Your only response was to say Thank heavens you dont live in Enfield.

Anyway Caroline i have decided i do want to engage in this discussion anymore as it is unfair to continuously ignore one half of my suggestion and  open discussions on the other half in isolation, 

I do not wish to be disrespectful to you as i know you care passionately about and believe in justice as i do , why else have i lived here for over 50 years.

It is a no brainer to invite discussion to rentroduce the right turn without introducing the no entry as discussed above

It would mean we are wasting time and resources ny opening a discusion purely yo be seen to be doing the democratic thing.

i must conclude that my language is not lucid  and that is  why half of my siggestion the more important part has been lost in translation.

May i please ask the powers that be to close the discussion down as it is becoming a point scoring exercise , which neither you nor  i wish to indulge in.

Hello All,

I live on Whittington Road and just wanted to reiterate how hellish the traffic was when we moved here in 2005, both in terms of the horrible behaviour and the pollution.

I wasn't involved but I was aware that many people from different streets put a lot of work into coming up with a solution that would improve things without having a really bad knock-on effect somewhere else - a really difficult thing to achieve and it really did take years.  

I don't drive and my husband does (by the way, as a resident/pedestrian I think my opinion is as important as his) and we agree that the slight inconvenience of turning right at the top of the road is a small price to pay for an area that isn't polluted and clogged with traffic.  

I am concerned that people might not be aware of, or might have forgotten how long it took to sort this out.  I also agree with Cathy that drivers running their engines and pumping out fumes is something that needs to be addressed.

 There are more ways than one to skin a cat ten years down the line,

What does your husband think of my two pronged suggestion you also have chosen  like Caroline to ignore  the more importnt aspect of my suggestion.

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